Team Thor: Thor Expedition 2006

[Rebel Rouser]

I think ........... Smokey made two 8500 footers that we wanted to stretch across Yosemite valley and they would not let us! Wonder if he might still have one?

[Tim White]

rebelrouser said:

...After all I am a 'cracker'.. ;D I went to the website. Not too elaborate on the info. In fact it's downright brief.
I also reckon this means Smokey has the rappel record established on Mt. Arrowsmith, B.C. Questions, questions............Kent

Yep, I understand 'cracker'.
Agree, the updated website is brief.
Mt. Arrowsmith Tell me more.

[Dee]

karstscience said:

The website doesn't shed much light on the topic. Who actually completed the rappel and ascent? All of them? What about the situation with the park ranger? Who loaned Robinson gear or did he have his own?

D I T T O !

[eyecave]

:'(kent......i have seen some very large spools of rope on his farm....hmmmmmmm

i will have to let kent explain that event.....i barely remember it, but i remember being impressed enough to have gone out and practiced rappeling on a slant.......and i discovered that it was fairly easy but a little different.... and i remember learning that i had to attach a small pulley or biner to the eye that i clipped to the rope to keep the rack from torquing too much!!.............and i remember figuring out that with much of a slant it really made adding a bar difficult and could make it impossible!........

climbing a slanted rope was hard as heck.....at the time i had never done that.........lots of hard work and i also had to attach things to me and then to the rope to keep my legs hips and torso kinda parrallel with the rope....

..

[Rebel Rouser]

In the late '80's I accompanied Smokey and others to Mt. Arrowsmith, Vancouver Island, British Columbia. We drove to a staging area approximately 6000 feet away from and below the peak of Mt Arrowsmith. At the staging area we attached the end of the rope to a helicopter. The pilot then flew the rope up and over the top of Mt Arrowsmith. He had to fly down the backside several feet so we could grab and secure the rope from the ground. Ever tether a June bug? Kind of like that, extrapolated. I don't recall the relief involved and it might be a stretch to call it a rappel. ;D I'll never forget that helicopter pilot though. He was as good as they get.
Kent

[Tim White]

How did I miss the story of Mt. Arrowsmith all these years living in TAG? I just asked Berta and she does not ever recall it either. Guess we are not as much "in the know" as I thought.
I suppose that may be where Bruce got the beta on ascending a slanting line for the 1st Edition of On Rope.

Wow! Cool trip, thanks for info, Kent.

(BTW: got any cave/bolt plans? Berta and I are up to one. The Hilti needs to be put to use. )

[Kelly]

Oh goodie! I just love Smokey stories. I've never heard that one. Sounds like a truely awesome time, though I don't think I could ever do that!

If you guys know Smokey, you may know my husband, Mike. He spend a few months living on the farm in a trailer with Howard while recovering from surgery on his knee. Of course this was a while back when Howard was just learning to make harnesses.

My favorite Smokey story is when he took his new bride to Golondrinas on their honeymoon. I think he said it was her first drop! He clipped her into his harness and they went down together. Then, if I recall correctly, at the bottom he pulled a bunch of webbing out of his pack and built her a climbing system. Smokey is probably the only person in the world I would ever trust with a stunt like that. Then again, I guess those types of things were more acceptable a few years back.

If you see him anytime soon, tell him Mike and Kelly say hello. Sure do need to go visit him again soon!

[Rebel Rouser]

Arrowsmith Smokey story ...... Smokey is first to ride in afternoon after rigging. He lands in tree 3/4 up drop due to line tensioning and ends up benighted in said tree. That was the evening that Smokey called himself on the radio. There was a long pause as everyone on the frequency waited for Smokey to answer himself. Anyway, Smokey climbs out of tree and begins a descent down short drops and scree with the occasional tree. Well, he's a natural in the woods so he has little problem dodging bears and finding his way to the staging area.
Next day rope is still hung in upper branches of same tree so I hike down to tree (4th class) to free rope. Once in tree I notice the slope below. Damn! front side of tree is 500ft in the air! I follow Smokey's route only to find myself making 5.6 moves, unroped, 500ft off the deck. Not really my 'cup of tea'. I mentioned this to him later and he commented on how when a rock cut loose it sounded like it was going a long ways but it was dark and he couldn't tell exactly what was below. Smokey's the best climber I know that never climbed!

[Dee]

taylor said:

The RCMP say it's still not clear how the accident happened and they are continuing their investigation. A group of tourists from the United States was rappelling in the area at the time, and police are talking to them to gather more information.

I probably will not get a response but I will still ask this question. Does anyone know if the Royal Canadian Mounted Police have completed their investigation into Philip Robinson's death?

[Off Rope]

I have not contacted, nor have I been contacted by, the RCMP since leaving the park. I have no knowledge of any member of Team Thor being contacted by, or contacting the RCMP since leaving the park.

I do not know if or when their investigation will be complete.

I have contacted the three park officails who were flown in from other park agencies to conduct an independent investigation of the accident and have been assured by at least one of those officials that we would recieve a copy once completed.

8 of the nine members stayed to de-rig the mountain, move gear out of the park completely, assist the with the Parcs Canada investigation and post accident reconstruction, and to meet with the deceased's family and all 8 returned together, as a team, on Sunday August 6.

The other one left us, still in the park, with the mountain still rigged and the investigation still on going. He did provide a statement to them prior to leaving, according to the park officials we spoke with, although it's my understanding that they had to go to him since he refused to come to their office.

Please forgive us as we all have independent lives to live and have not had the heart or time to post prior to this. I am only posting now because my truck is in the shop, I can't get to work and so, I had some time on my hands plus the 'abandoner' showed up at my home last night telling me about all these posts. One team member suggested I respond. I thought about it and although I don't know the intentions of those reading these post's (who else is going to show up at a Team Thor members home in the middle of the night?) there are those reading this, like Tim White and Lynn Roebuck, who will benefit from this knowledge so I chose to submit this post.

I am only one member and I was not on the mountain summit when Philip began his fateful rappel. I had completed my rappel and moved my camp to base as I was given the task of bringing the haul cord from base camp to the 'beach' the next day. I was in my tent, asleep, alone when the accident occurred. My batteries were slowly dying and I knew I'd need to communicate with the summit the next day, so my radio was turned off for the night. At the time I rappelled I was unaware that Philip was making his way up the backside and had no immediate knowledge that he was going to rappel. I did not see him rappel nor did I see his body at the accident scene at the bottom of the rope. I did help load his body into a helicopter less than 24 hours after the accident, however.

If you really want to know and if I think it wise, I will answer any questions you may have privately. E-mail me at [e-mail]. Don't expect instant replies however.

Thank you for your patience and understanding regarding this matter.

Regards,

The Dirtman

[Tim White]

Dirtman-

Thank you for the post!

[L Roebuck]

Thanks for taking the time to post, Dirtman.

[Kelly]

Thanks for posting dirk! Our thoughts of course go out to the ranger and his family, and to you guys who stuck around to help out (particularly our friends :)that were out there). Do you know what happened to him? Why he lost control?

[madratdan]

I too, would like to echo a thanks for your informative post.

[Dee]

Thank you for the post and the attempt to answer my earlier question.

[Rebel Rouser]

offrope said:

Please forgive us as we all have independent lives to live and have not had the heart or time to post prior to this. I am only posting now because my truck is in the shop, I can't get to work and so, I had some time on my hands plus the 'abandoner' showed up at my home last night telling me about all these posts. One team member suggested I respond. I thought about it and although I don't know the intentions of those reading these post's (who else is going to show up at a Team Thor members home in the middle of the night?) there are those reading this, like Tim White and Lynn Roebuck, who will benefit from this knowledge so I chose to submit this post.

I am only one member and I was not on the mountain summit when Philip began his fateful rappel. I had completed my rappel and moved my camp to base as I was given the task of bringing the haul cord from base camp to the 'beach' the next day. I was in my tent, asleep, alone when the accident occurred. My batteries were slowly dying and I knew I'd need to communicate with the summit the next day, so my radio was turned off for the night. At the time I rappelled I was unaware that Philip was making his way up the backside and had no immediate knowledge that he was going to rappel. I did not see him rappel nor did I see his body at the accident scene at the bottom of the rope. I did help load his body into a helicopter less than 24 hours after the accident, however.

If you really want to know and if I think it wise, I will answer any questions you may have privately. E-mail me at [e-mail]. Don't expect instant replies however.

Thank you for your patience and understanding regarding this matter.

Regards,

The Dirtman

It is in the nature of expeditions for the public (especially the ones participating in same sport) to want to know details. Also you were attempting a record and there was a death involved. People might want to know the conditions you encountered just as y'all likely inquired of Thor '82. Supposedly our record has been broken and I would like to know more about the front side. Lastly, and certainly the most difficult to assess, understanding of what happened to Mr. Robinson. we need to glean info from the tragedies so as to prevent them in the future. Putting up a website and obtaining sponsors also puts you in the spotlight. I do understand recuperation time and I guess we ought to be thankful for what we got.
I would guess that the intentions of most posters here would be interest in your expedition. Have there been people that sought others out over posts made about Thor? So the story is going to trickle out via email IF we make the cut.......like maybe don't share....
I understand getting back to the real world takes time but the questions will never go and since y'all are claiming the record then I want to know more about the rappel. I mean it is our record your breaking!
So the Canadian authorities are investigating a rappelling accident? Reckon they'll figure it out? Let me tell ya......if the cavers that were there, augmented by the vertical experience hither and yon can't figure it out then I'm betting the RCMP will boge the seq, take the whip,crater and do the fish dance! (I've always wanted to write that. ;D) Robinson was supposedly an "experienced climber". That says something right there. How many "experienced cavers" are going to go out to the big stone and start working a 5.10 A5 aid route knowing little of big wall technique. What level of expertise ya guess the front of Thor would rate?
More than once I've had to turn down climbers that just topped out the Salathe Wall or the Nose and wanted to use our rope as a quick way to the Mtn. Room bar. They had no idea what they were asking and we politely explained that their figure 8 would not work! The Salathe goes free at 5.13b so they did not lack climbing experience. I say all this not trying to judge but to understand and prevent. Sometimes that requires asking tough questions. kent

[eyecave]

kent.... ..i see what you are saying and its as though you have been reading private emails.. ....that i didn't send to you... ...

,,,,,azagroup....rockclimbers don't have a clue about rappeling WITH A RACK...........let me take it a bit further......their basic philosophy and techniques mirrors the idea of gripping the rope and dragging the rope over body parts for slowing a rap via friction using the body due to the devices they typically use to descend a rope when they are just beginning to do rock cliimbing...or even just experienced bouldering............

the rack is s'posed to be used by pushing each and all of the bars up to increase friction and the grip of the gloved hand and your hip and leg wraps are last second near death attempts to slow your totally out of control rappel that started after you added and the descent exceeded the friction of your 6th or 8th bar...

[eyecave]

hey....dirk.... ...simple question.'s.......take ya two seconds to answer....... who climbed the drop?...who was it that defeated that angle that was rather acute if you went to the nose........you know....the spot where we divided up the thor 0h four rope.....where jamie set the bolts.......where the stroking came out perfect.....

...second question........or did you just go straight on down.....just follow gravity straight down to the valley floor.......to the huge flat rock on the far side of the small pond.............either way...... the onset of the j rap concept...............

ok dirkman.......i admit.....i cheated........i asked two questions...........so sorry.........

[Off Rope]

I witnessed Chuck, Timmy, Kenny, Ben and Donny climb. Philip rappeled once Ben and Donny climbed.

We did not rap all the way to the valley floor as the J was too brutal to climb at that point. We rapped to the top of the scree to about where we set the bottom bolt in '04 although it was secured to a boulder to the climbers right of that bolt.

[Rebel Rouser]

Rock climbers have always regarded the rappel to be the most hazardous part of the journey. Many climbers are killed or injured not during the climb but while on descent. I would mention my good friend Chris C. but that but that might not classify as descent related. I would go further and say that IMHO many (vertical) cavers using racks have come or will come very close to the edge with equipment and not even realize it's proximity.
Any pictures of the landing area at base? How far down talus below base of wall did y'all go? Sorry to bug you but most on here won't know where "the top of the scree to about where we set the bottom bolt in '04"is located. I've been trying to find pics that show the full frontal view with entire talus slope. It would be neat to see where y'all rappelled to! ;D kent

[Off Rope]

I don't have any from this trip but I have a pic from 04.

[L Roebuck]

If you don't mind would you post the pic?