L Roebuck
Technical Support
Caving
^V^ Just a caver
Posts: 2,023
|
Post by L Roebuck on Apr 13, 2007 7:48:18 GMT -5
Humm......Ebay seller eel.wreck currently has a ' NSS News 1991 Members Manual ' listed for sale. The buy it now price is $8.00. " NSS News Part II, May 1991, 1991 members manual, 130 pages, The National Speleological Society, FON on cover, back cover has been cut off, otherwise good condition. " Link |
|
|
|
Post by Azurerana on Apr 13, 2007 12:19:02 GMT -5
Did you alert someone in the NSS office? I'm sure they'd be interested to know.
|
|
L Roebuck
Technical Support
Caving
^V^ Just a caver
Posts: 2,023
|
Post by L Roebuck on Apr 13, 2007 14:07:48 GMT -5
No, I sure didn't. I have been informed the NSS Office as well as others in the NSS Hierarchy surf the US Cavers Forum on a regular basis - so I imagine they have already seen the post.  |
|
|
|
Post by Innermostphoto on Apr 18, 2007 21:40:46 GMT -5
What? Alert the NSS office? For what?? Do you think it is against the law to sell a NSS book on E-bay or anywhere else for that matter? I can’t stand this elitist attitude that publications produced by the NSS, its grottos, or any other guidebook cannot be sold in a capitalist society. I am free to sell to the highest bidder any publication that I own which includes NSS manuals, bulletins and the monthly news letter. In addition, I can sell Convention, TAG, SERA, Speleofest etc. etc. guidebooks (and I have a lot of ‘em) as well as TCS information. There is no law against it. Now, you may say some of the information is proprietary but still does not mean you can’t sell it. It was SOLD to you! Once in your possession you are free to do with it at will. Copyright laws do not apply as you are not duplicating, altering, or modifying an existing work for personal gain. Selling cave information is kinda like selling a painting you purchased. On the flip side it may not be the most ethical thing to do and many cavers will seek ill will toward you. I know of a few that I want to keep on my good side but there is nothing to keep anyone from selling these articles. Besides, what can they get out of a 1991 NSS members manual anyway? A bunch of out dated phone numbers and addresses? bob biddix Innermost Imagery www.innermostimagery.com |
|
|
|
Post by Azurerana on Apr 20, 2007 17:40:45 GMT -5
What? Alert the NSS office? For what?? Do you think it is against the law to sell a NSS book on E-bay or anywhere else for that matter?<,snip> A bunch of out dated phone numbers and addresses? Bob--I agree with you wholeheartedly for EVERYTHING except the member's manual. Why are you convinced that the addresses and phone numbers are outdated? Some are incorrect, for sure, but there are still lots of them which are not, and they've already been presorted to ensure a high likelihood of interest in the outdoors, camping equipment, environmental concerns, etc. Even if a mass mailer sent out to the whole list, and got a 15 to 20% return it still beats the usual return rate for an unsorted mailing list. I manage a member's mailing list for a state organization. We distribute our member's directory only to the members. We distribute only on paper except to our Supporting (commercial) members, who may request an electronic format. (Very few do). They pay double what a regular member does, and are expected to provide product donations for our scholarship auction in return for soliciting the members. All member lists are distributed with the disclaimer that they are to be used for personal use only, and that any commercial use (for the active members), rental, or sale of the lists will result in the expulsion of the offending member. The implied contract between the NSS and the member is similar-- contact info is furnished for use by the member and the NSS only. I believe there was one time the NSS rented the list to an outside party which was not benefitting the NSS (i.e., not a car rental NSS member discount sort of thing) and there was a major kerfluffle over it. You cannot belong to the NSS without giving them the member info, and therefore they have an interest in preserving control over its circulation in accordance with the conditions under which it was given. My intent in asking if anyone had notified the NSS office was not to prevent the sale, but to alert them that it was occurring, and that they might get some fallout if the sold manual went to a mass marketer. I do not agree that one buys a member manual in the same sense that one buys a Speleo Digest or other cave book. I don't know about you, but I am on every do not call, do not solicit, do not email, do not junkmail list out there. I actually report violators of these lists to the appropriate place. I've got a personal interest when someone is selling MY contact information. That's my story and I'm sticking to it. *|;-) |
|
|
|
Post by Innermostphoto on Apr 20, 2007 22:12:27 GMT -5
Ok So I can see how you might take issue with some "sensitive" information being made available to the public but lets be realistic. What do you really think it would be purchased for? Mass marketing as you describe? Even though it potentially could be used for EVIL I seriously doubt it. Like you, I try to maintain my information to be private and I do not wish to have unsolicited junk barking at me every time I turn around. Still, some information is widely known no matter what your intentions or how much you try to hoard contact information. **note contact information below** bob biddix Innermost Imagery www.innermostimagery.com |
|
